Recruitment

[10-7]

FYI and I have it based on good rumor (????) that the next academy class slated for May has 19 (yes, 19) cadets scheduled for the class. 19 statewide. It appears that we have a major recruitment problem and it doesn't seem to be getting better (Valley Division just sucked in 9 new background investigators to put as many folks in the upcoming academy classes). The 2nd rumor that is going around that due to the "lack of interest", that class may be cancelled.

Seems we're lacking folks that are interested in doing this job.

I would imagine any suggestions on how to fix this situation, directed to the powers in charge, would be greatly appreciated.

[TheForceCHP]

WOW:shock:

i don't know what to say, i take my oral psych on mond. and after that i will be ready to go, but not for the may class. i guarantee that i will be in the sept. class though

i seriously hope that people start stepping up too the plate and joining

[makakona]

whooooooooa. :sad: i wondered when i read that post saying there'd be somewhere near 200. :\ "they" "said" that about the last two classes, too, and obviously that's not what happened. :sad:

that makes me so sad. i wish i was one of those super brainstorming women who could come up with ten great solutions.

[retchp]

I don't know if the above is true or not, but it would not surprise me if it turns out to be the case. About thirty years ago, right after my class hit the field the department was required by the geniuses who run this state to endure a "hiring freeze" to "save money". No one was hired after the class after mine for about five years.
Then after that, for the next thirty years, the department was barely able to keep up with attrition (retirees, firees, quittees and injuries). Meanwhile, the state's population approximately doubled and that doesn't even count the illegal immigrants.
Now we are faced with all of the people who came on just before me and with me and even some who came on after the freeze was lifted retiring.
This creates a real need for many, many officers. This could have been easily predicted by anyone who cared to look at the stats for the last thirty years, but that would have been too easy to do and it wasn't done at all apparently.
Couple the above with a general fear for their own personal safety by young comfortable coddled adults and there develops an exceedingly small pool of true applicants.
You now have a real problem for the Department and a real opportunity for a motivated young man or woman.
I have always felt that the background process is the bottle neck in the whole deal too, but really don't know what the solution to that is, but there needs to be some thought given to streamlining that process somehow.

[Welpe]

retchp, you are right, it is an opportunity for us determined candidates. It is unfortunate the department is having this much trouble though. As was discussed in another thread, I guess the improving economy and plethora of private sector jobs are a big factor.

[uoplax13]

If they can bust through my background in the two weeks after the PAT coming up in May I will gladly say goodbye to all the snow up here! Something tells me that isn't too likely.....

I took a class a while back in which we discussed the backlog with the government's security clearance process, and it seems that the CHP might be in a similar situation. You can't "tone down" the hiring process to get more people ( you wouldn't get as good a product), but maybe there is a way to streamline it while maintaining the high standards. Maybe there's a job for me in recruitment after some time on the road!

[SuperTrooper]

I think the department should try changing its imagine a little. When most people find out that I'm applying with the CHP they don't even know what it is, or they ask "why the hell would you want to be one of those guys?". :confused: But don't worry, the new CHiPs movie will be coming out soon enough and should stir up some public interest/awareness... unless the writers and studio butcher it like CHiPs '99.

[NorCalN00b]

I think the reason is because of the pay. Alot of city police departments offer far better pay than the CHP. I read that the CHP's contract will expire on June so lets all hope the Chippes get more pay!!

[RodeoChippie]

FYI and I have it based on good rumor (????) that the next academy class slated for May has 19 (yes, 19) cadets scheduled for the class. 19 statewide. It appears that we have a major recruitment problem and it doesn't seem to be getting better (Valley Division just sucked in 9 new background investigators to put as many folks in the upcoming academy classes). The 2nd rumor that is going around that due to the "lack of interest", that class may be cancelled.

Seems we're lacking folks that are interested in doing this job.

I would imagine any suggestions on how to fix this situation, directed to the powers in charge, would be greatly appreciated.
I heard the first at training day yesterday. We were told the last class started with about half of what they had anticipated and that the May class was very low in numbers and was going to be pushed back. Then the converstation turned to recruitment and the testing process and how antiquated it was and the definite need to streamline the process. Then there was talk about pulling guys from the road to do backgrounds. That went over like a fart in church. Guys working the road are already shorthanded and expected to do more with less on a daily basis. It came back around to we need to do more recruiting personally.

[Fire1]

So if the word is that the May class "could"/"might" be small or pushed back, how far would they push it. I have passed everything and am on the eligibility list at cadet hiring waiting for the official invite letter. It would kinda suck to have to wait another x months to get on with things. Hey if nothing else, it would make for more time to train, but enough waiting is enough already. If they need people so bad, then why do they wait till the last minute to send out letters. I know that is just one part of the process, but it seems like just another area that could be sped up.

[Officer_Grady]

funny how some departments says there's no money for classes and three weeks later, they find money. With us, we can't find enough people.

[CACHP]

One of the suggestions is to contact all CHP cadets who resigned/ dropped out from the academy and ask them if they want to come back. The state invested so much money to get them aboard, why not give them a second chance.

Someone who drops out because he/she was not physically prepared for the academy have to go through the whole process again if they want to come back (except the written exam it is good for life once you past it). Why not give them some time off to get in shape and come back?

Cadets drop out for variety of reasons. Some people drop out because they simply can?t change their lifestyle that quickly. For example, if a person sleeps 8 hours a day, it is hard to suddenly change the schedule and only get 5 hours of sleep, in addition to 19 hours of constant motion, such as PT, academics, marching, studying, etc. Everyone says that you have to prepare for the academy before reporting, but no one ever can prepare themselves 100%.

We live in a completely different society nowadays. Some of us can not learn under a constant pressure accompanied by a lack of sleep. Some of us can, but some simply cannot and it doesn?t mean that a person who cannot is not capable of doing the job. About 30% of cadets drop out for one reason or another. Why not review the training style just like the military did. Why not be friendlier and tell why certain things are done the way they are done. Police officers are thought to explain things to citizens but cadets are simply told what to do without any explanation. In many cases cadets have to figure out what to do on their own. Why not encourage a cadet to do more push-ups by telling him, ?You can do it. You need to be strong to overcome your opponent,? instead of yelling at him, ?Come one nasty, you fat bum, go home.? Where is the need to discourage cadets by telling them ?go home?, by yelling at them, by taking away their liberty? Why can?t staff officers be just like instructors, friendly, open, willing to help? Cadets are treated like garbage at the academy. The punishment doesn?t fit the violation.

Many of you will not agree with what I am saying and I completely respect your opinion. You might say that it is less likely for the person who has gone through the academy to let you down in the field. I disagree. Sometimes person you less expected will stick by your side, while your best buddy be running away. Time changes, society changes. If there is a lack of people who wants to join CHP, simply raising the salary will not do the trick because ?good? people will continue to drop out form the academy. There is no need to be tough if you can verbally gain control of the situation. Verbal Judo. Basically what I am trying to say that whoever drops out from the academy is not a ?bad? person for the job. I believe a drop out rate can be lowered by changing the training environment, which in turn will save the state bunch of money and have more officers filling the vacancies.

[Officer_Grady]

CA, I see your point, but you've heard here "It was tougher when I went through." I was back at in service, I can't remember if it was last time or two times ago. In the halls of the class area, I saw cadets drinking Starbucks and had a box of dozen Cinnabons. They never had it better. For all we know, they might have had Jack and Cola in the Starbucks cups, then they'd be living.

[Dipmo]

One of the suggestions is to contact all CHP cadets who resigned/ dropped out from the academy and ask them if they want to come back. The state invested so much money to get them aboard, why not give them a second chance.

Someone who drops out because he/she was not physically prepared for the academy have to go through the whole process again if they want to come back (except the written exam it is good for life once you past it). Why not give them some time off to get in shape and come back?

Cadets drop out for variety of reasons. Some people drop out because they simply can?t change their lifestyle that quickly. For example, if a person sleeps 8 hours a day, it is hard to suddenly change the schedule and only get 5 hours of sleep, in addition to 19 hours of constant motion, such as PT, academics, marching, studying, etc. Everyone says that you have to prepare for the academy before reporting, but no one ever can prepare themselves 100%.

We live in a completely different society nowadays. Some of us can not learn under a constant pressure accompanied by a lack of sleep. Some of us can, but some simply cannot and it doesn?t mean that a person who cannot is not capable of doing the job. About 30% of cadets drop out for one reason or another. Why not review the training style just like the military did. Why not be friendlier and tell why certain things are done the way they are done. Police officers are thought to explain things to citizens but cadets are simply told what to do without any explanation. In many cases cadets have to figure out what to do on their own. Why not encourage a cadet to do more push-ups by telling him, ?You can do it. You need to be strong to overcome your opponent,? instead of yelling at him, ?Come one nasty, you fat bum, go home.? Where is the need to discourage cadets by telling them ?go home?, by yelling at them, by taking away their liberty? Why can?t staff officers be just like instructors, friendly, open, willing to help? Cadets are treated like garbage at the academy. The punishment doesn?t fit the violation.

Many of you will not agree with what I am saying and I completely respect your opinion. You might say that it is less likely for the person who has gone through the academy to let you down in the field. I disagree. Sometimes person you less expected will stick by your side, while your best buddy be running away. Time changes, society changes. If there is a lack of people who wants to join CHP, simply raising the salary will not do the trick because ?good? people will continue to drop out form the academy. There is no need to be tough if you can verbally gain control of the situation. Verbal Judo. Basically what I am trying to say that whoever drops out from the academy is not a ?bad? person for the job. I believe a drop out rate can be lowered by changing the training environment, which in turn will save the state bunch of money and have more officers filling the vacancies.


I know you have been there and done that and I have not, but I must disagree with you on a few things here. I don't think they need to change the training environment at all. It's a good thing to get a gauge of a cadet's mental toughness in a controlled and safe environment before they get to the street and that verbal attack could very well be preceding a physical attack. If they break down in front of a staff officer, they may very well do the same on the road

I understand that officers will sometimes be asked to take a long and complicated call right at the end of their shift; shouldn't cadets have to prove that they have the moxy to work in overloaded and stressful conditions that before it really counts on the road?

As far as preparation and warning go, I think most cadets had plenty before they got to the academy. I took the PAT twice, both times at the academy and while it was an inspiring place to be we were readily available to the PT staff for a talking to. At my last one in January we were told that we would "run on fumes while you are here." We told several times that academy life would not be easy academically, mentally, and physically and that if were not getting ready we were doing a disservice to ourselves and the CHP.

I also disagree that academy drop outs should have an easy way back. With all due respect, you had your chance and gave it up. You should have to prove that you deserve another just as much as I have to prove that I deserve a first chance.

Kinder and gentler is not the way to go in the military or law enforcement. The enemy and the criminals are not getting softer and there is not a conceivable chance you could convince me of a reason the soldiers and cops should be either.

As of this moment I am a citizen of this state and as such I want to know that the people charged with keeping me and my family safe are the best, brightest, and most mentally tough people out there. If you want to go back I sincerely wish you the best of luck in getting back, but I don't think it should be an easy road.

[10-7]

I was at the academy several weeks ago and watched as a staff services officer berated and berated and berated a cadet for failing to remove his cover when he walked in the door near the PX. I've watched the cadets at the staff services window get the same yelling and yelling and yelling treatment. I wouldn't treat my dog that way. If you want to teach a cadet how to do things and how not to do things, sure, yell at him to make him tough and give him his punishment (blue card, whatever) and then take a breath and save some oxygen for the rest of us. It was embarrasing to watch these antics. Just another "badge-heavy-arrested 3 dueces-took four crashes in my entire career, but now assigned to the academy - 17000 ID" trying to make a name for himself. THEN they wonder why cadets say "^%!! it, I'm outa here". This needs to be a learning place, not a place to make one feel like crap.

I've also got an ear over at backgrounds. Seems the top two DQ topics are 1. Drugs, 2. Credit (so, if you have good drugs and / or bad credit, ya'd better get squared away before applying). These are the main items that get a person DQ'ed. Guess its a different group than it was 24 years ago.

I also hear that so far, only about 500 applications for the next written have been received. To keep up with just retirements, the dept. needs to graduate over 200 folks per class. Kinda looks like we're on a sinking ship and no one knows what to do about it. Its a bit tough when local departments are offering stuff like "top step within 2 years...sign-on bonus...4/10 shifts.." etc. We offer free room / board / gettin' yelled at for 26 (?) weeks and then get to go to one of the most expensive places in the US to try to live on $50K / year.

Not griping. Just throwing the stuff on the table.

[KingFrankSam]

CACHP, you are contradicting yourself. Above, you state the following:

Why not encourage a cadet to do more push-ups by telling him, ?You can do it. You need to be strong to overcome your opponent,? instead of yelling at him, ?Come one nasty, you fat bum, go home.? Where is the need to discourage cadets by telling them ?go home?, by yelling at them, by taking away their liberty? Why can?t staff officers be just like instructors, friendly, open, willing to help? Cadets are treated like garbage at the academy. The punishment doesn?t fit the violation.

In a prior post, you state:

There will be lots of things designed, you might think, to make you give up, but in reality those things were designed to make you stronger. Whatever you might think can give you a hard time, just tell yourself "Bring it on" and take the challenge.

I think your earlier post is an appropriate and correct response to your post above. If you get the chance to go back, you had better regain the proper mindset.

[nobody33]

It's been about 2 years since CHiPS has been rerunning on the air. Despite its age, lack of reality, and cheesiness, I suspect that has something to do with it. I also can't remember the last time I saw an episode of "real stories of the highway patrol" on tv. While I think it goes deeper than that, I suspect the lack of national free publicity that makes the job look "sexy" is a factor. The explorer posts were a huge recruiting tool for a while as well. And it seems to be a applicants market for law enforcement throughout the nation.

I thought I was forgotten about when I didn't hear from the department for 7 months after getting my 95 score. Now I'm looking at 2 offers at about the same time. It will be a tough choice. The 8 hour shifts, salary falling behind, and high stress academy are real turnoffs. Especially with other agencies having generous salaries, easier go home to your own bed at night academies, and some departments in so cal now starting take home car programs.


While an unpopular idea, I think with a lateral program, the recruitment crisis would disappear.

[Officer_Grady]

take home car, you can get yourself in more doo doo. You might even get taxed on it.

[CACHP]

This needs to be a learning place, not a place to make one feel like crap.

This is exactly what I was talking about. Thank you for understanding 10-7!

[makakona]

i think dipmo summed up most of what i would have said, but with a LOT more diplomacy. i'm not really known for my tact when it comes to message boards, haha. ;)

i'm tellin' ya', they need to recruit the mormons! that'll solve all of that "drink, swear, steal, and lie" stuff. ;)

This needs to be a learning place, not a place to make one feel like crap.

This is exactly what I was talking about. Thank you for understanding 10-7!

i dunno... i don't think my husband was ever made to "feel like crap." you own your feelings... you can either choose to understand the motivation behind it or you can wallow in it. my husband and i discussed this thread last night and, as someone who's "been there, done that," he was in total opposition to what cachp said about the academy experience. we both agree that if a dropout wants a second chance, they can feel free to join the end of the line.

my dad and i took a bit of a roadtrip today and talked about everything under the sun. talking about the chp shortages, the best he could come up with was better pay, which obviously is way easier said than done.

and i think there's something behind the statement about "kids these days."

[RodeoChippie]

We live in a completely different society nowadays. Some of us can not learn under a constant pressure accompanied by a lack of sleep. Some of us can, but some simply cannot and it doesn?t mean that a person who cannot is not capable of doing the job. About 30% of cadets drop out for one reason or another. Why not review the training style just like the military did. Why not be friendlier and tell why certain things are done the way they are done. Police officers are thought to explain things to citizens but cadets are simply told what to do without any explanation. In many cases cadets have to figure out what to do on their own. Why not encourage a cadet to do more push-ups by telling him, ?You can do it. You need to be strong to overcome your opponent,? instead of yelling at him, ?Come one nasty, you fat bum, go home.? Where is the need to discourage cadets by telling them ?go home?, by yelling at them, by taking away their liberty? Why can?t staff officers be just like instructors, friendly, open, willing to help? Cadets are treated like garbage at the academy. The punishment doesn?t fit the violation.


In addition to my regular employment I also teach Physical Training at the local Police Academy. I have done so for the past 6 years. I can tell you from personal experience that the classes at this Academy that are pushed and ridden harder, by far, produce a better quality deputy or police officer. There is a reason for everything that is done at any Academy. Everything we do as a PT staff has to be justified and the training value shown to the Director. You are right about this being a completely different society. It seems the video game and computer era is upon us. Individuals show up on the first day and are shocked to find out the Academy isn't like the college classes they had been taken. Some have never had anybody even raise their voice to then. I'll tell you what I tell them. They are going to get yelled at, stressed and pushed beyond what they are accustomed to. Things are probably going to be said to them that they don't like too much. TOO BAD! Any Academy is a sterile training environment. If a Cadet is gonna "nut up" in a training environment when an instructor yells at them, how are they likely to react on the streets when they are dealing with some 3rd striker parolee who tell them to go #$%& themselves and their mother. Maybe, just maybe, if people are so sensitive and unable to deal with this type of pressure they should look into another line of work. Law enforcement isn't for everyone.

Now I also know for a fact that you cannot maintain this type of atmosphere for the entire time Cadets are at the Academy. Eventually the stress level drops as the Cadets get closer to graduating. But it doesn't happen 6 weeks into the Academy.
If you're looking for a pat on the bottom and to be told you're doing a great job, join a gym and go to a step aeorbics class.

[TheForceCHP]

If you're looking for a pat on the bottom and to be told you're doing a great job, join a gym and go to a step aeorbics class.


Rodeo, you just made my sig. for that great line!!! I am off too the gym right now...

[Officer_Grady]

Rodeo, make sure you got a secondary employment on file. :lol:

[CACHP]

CACHP, you are contradicting yourself. Above, you state the following:

Why not encourage a cadet to do more push-ups by telling him, ?You can do it. You need to be strong to overcome your opponent,? instead of yelling at him, ?Come one nasty, you fat bum, go home.? Where is the need to discourage cadets by telling them ?go home?, by yelling at them, by taking away their liberty? Why can?t staff officers be just like instructors, friendly, open, willing to help? Cadets are treated like garbage at the academy. The punishment doesn?t fit the violation.

In a prior post, you state:

There will be lots of things designed, you might think, to make you give up, but in reality those things were designed to make you stronger. Whatever you might think can give you a hard time, just tell yourself "Bring it on" and take the challenge.

I think your earlier post is an appropriate and correct response to your post above. If you get the chance to go back, you had better regain the proper mindset.

Horatio,
I disagree with you about contradicting myself because in my prior post I was giving an advice to prospective cadets on current academy training environment. In this post I was suggesting a change, which I believe would lessen the drop out rate. The reason behind lessening the drop out rate is to graduate more cadets. More graduated cadets means more new officers at the field. I don't know how many officers drop out during the break-in but I heard a lot. Why not let everyone graduate and then see how they perform at the field? Remember, we are trying to solve a problem of department understaffing and not who is tougher. I strongly believe that more lenient academy environment will lessen drop out rate because number of good cadets drop out because of the harsh environment.

There used to be a CHP academy somewhere in LA area but it was closed. To reopen it, in order to graduate more cadets, will cost the department big money, but to graduate cadets who might drop out, because they don?t want to be humiliated, would save money. Hypothetically speaking: Let?s say about 25 cadets drop out from every class. 25 cadets times 4 classes a year is 100 cadets. About 100 cadets drop out from the academy in one year. That is like a whole class. Approximately $60K is spent during the hiring process per cadet so $60K *100 = $6,000,000 a year. If the academy loses 100 cadets every year, $6,000,000 is lost every year. I am sure these moneys can be used for other things. And with such a loss a year it comes out to only three classes a year instead of four.

I think academy should not be a cut off point for someone who might become an outstanding CHP officer. What about a computer genius who wants to work in CHP computer forensics lab? He has to go through the academy just like anyone else but would he stick around for long in present training environment? I doubt it.

Also, if a said there should be an easy way for dropped out cadets to come back to the academy, I apologize; I meant there should be a simple way. I, myself, haven?t thought about going back, but I do know couple of people who dropped out and want to go back. One dropped out because of harsh environment and the other because of PT. I think giving dropped out cadets a second chance will minimize the departmental hiring spending because they don?t have to be put through extensive background check. Once again, this post, as I understood it, was about suggesting how to save money and hire/ keep more people. Sorry, if I misled someone. I am not trying to change your point of view. I am just presenting mine. Thank you for listening.

[makakona]

Why not let everyone graduate and then see how they perform at the field?

...to graduate cadets who might drop out, because they don?t want to be humiliated, would save money.

I think academy should not be a cut off point for someone who might become an outstanding CHP officer.

Also, if a said there should be an easy way for dropped out cadets to come back to the academy, I apologize; I meant there should be a simple way.

simple, easy, tomatoes, to-MAH-toes.

i hope the above statements are a case of not thinking them through before typing versus actually believing in them. i'm GLAD those people who couldn't stand a little yelling dropped out. it means i don't have to worry about whether they'll walk when they're supposed to have my husband's back.

[KingFrankSam]

Why not let everyone graduate and then see how they perform at the field?

Because, failure at the Academy means that you go home and pursue a different career. Failure in the field means that you never go home. This career choice is not a game. Either a person has what it takes, or they don't. Those who don't are going to hurt themselves or someone else. It is the Department's duty to do everything possible to prevent those liabilities from hitting the field.

[CHP1929]

Its time to really lay it out there!

The lack of applicants is due to a combination of reasons. Some of them the Department is responsible for and some of them are societal. I don?t do this job for the pay and the benefits. I do this job because I love it! I don?t always love the Department (and every decision they make), but I love my job. The Department can always do more (money, benefits, take home car etc.) but you have to be a realist and understand how the state (or local or the feds) works. I am making more money then I ever have and live comfortably. Generally, I have all the tools to do my job each day. Now that?s out the way, let?s get to the real reason:

Society is in the ?what?s in it for me?? mode.

This is very apparent in the types of applicants the Department and nearly all employers are dealing with. I have heard stories about young people that work in the computer industry walking up to their boss and asking for a raise because they have been there for 6 months. My response: Big deal?GET BACK TO WORK! I have even seen some people post on these forums who have that attitude and I hope they never work for this Department.

This whole entitlement thing has got to go! As a cadet you are entitled to nothing! You have to prove yourself and earn the privilege to serve the people of this state. Oh yeah?as for the person who wants to work in the CHP?s ?computer forensics lab? but they don?t want to stick it out through the Academy?I have two words for you?GO AWAY! Being an officer is not the job for you. If you want to work for the Department in a different capacity, then fine, but don?t use the Department for your own personal agenda.

I have heard that cadets said they shouldn?t be yelled at because they have a college education. What the heck is that all about? Do you really think the wanted felon, reckless driver, or DUI driver you stop cares whether or not you have college education? They may yell at you or they may try and kill you.

In my opinion, a good portion of people in the hiring pool (20-35 yrs old) are spineless fools. They don?t want to do this job because they are afraid. They don?t want to be disciplined, respectful or risk their life for anything other than their SUV w/22 inch spinners, X-Box or Ipod. The remaining few that are disciplined and who aren?t afraid are out of the country right now trying to protect what is country stands for.

I know I am not alone in saying that people you stop are more likely not to pony up to their mistake (more correctly ? their choice) and give you a earful on the side of road. It is society people! Why should we expect anything different for the hiring pool. How many times have you gone to a place of business (restaurant, department store etc.) and dealt with a total idiot. Those kind of people apply for this job too!

Someone said that the backgrounds screw up the whole process. I disagree. It allows people who really want to be here to stick it out and more importantly it makes less of a chance that I don?t have to work with someone who is not entitled to wear the badge. I know there are people out there that ask, "Why can?t I be any officer just because I made poor financial decisions, ?experimented? with drugs (whatever :rolleyes: ), got a DUI, three speeding tickets and got fired from a couple of jobs?? Why??.why??.because I don?t want to work with someone that has no discipline or respect and who obviously can?t make a decent decision to save their life (or someone elses)!

So here?s how to fix the problem:

1. Actively recruit people in places where the qualified applicants are. That means staying away from the shopping malls during the week. The good people have jobs already and are out on the weekends! (Sorry if you work shift work and weekends?you know what I mean.:smile: )
2. Make sure there is enough personnel available to process/evaluate the correct number of applicants in a efficient and timely manner.
3. Keep everything at the academy the same. If you can?..make it harder! If you can?t handle someone yelling at you they you probably aren?t fit for the job. The academy is not a college campus, it is a training facility.
4. Like nobody 33 said get back on the TV with something to peak the interest of those qualified persons and to really showcase what this Department is all about.

The bottom line.

The future of this Department and most importantly the safety and security of the people of California depends on a thorough hiring/selection/training process, regardless of how much it costs. Just because it?s cheaper doesn?t mean it?s better.

That?s just my $ .02 and I?m sure many of are going to disagree?.so let the battle begin.
:biggrin:

[KingFrankSam]

CHP1929, that's one hell of a first post! It is hard to argue with good sense and the truth, but someone here will try.

[RoadDawg]

This thread is blowing me away? (Not literally :biggrin: ) Most of you posting in this thread have not even been through our Academy, so what do you have to base your opinion on? CACHP post like he/she is an officer, but its not confirmed through the website, and from his / her views, I doubt it? Nonetheless, I don?t think any of us enjoyed our stay at the Academy, but things are done for a reason? and we respect it, and see the reasons in the end.

So they were yelling at some cadet in the staff office? maybe he needed it! Maybe this cadet is someone who is totally FUBAR and they are trying to run him off so he?s not your beat partner. I only had to report to the staff once, and yes I got yelled at, but it did me no harm. They cant touch you, beat you or cause you any intentional bodily harm, so how bad can it be? If you want a job where you face controversy every day, you had better be able to let someone yell at you a little.

I could only imagine if we sent everyone right through the Academy, and tried to weed them out in the field. If one of them snapped and shot someone for no just reason, I could hear them now, ?I just lost it, Ive never been put under pressure like that before and I couldnt control myself.? This job isn?t like working at ?Blockbuster Video? where we can see how you do first and then decide later if we want to keep you?. If the overwhelming majority of us who have been through it, and do the job on a daily basis aren?t complaining about how our training is done, then what makes anyone else qualified to do so?

Have any of you forgotten?. THEY GIVE US LOADED GUNS, to go along with our badges! If you cant take a little pressure, this job is not for you? plain and simple!

[Mac]

Great post, CHP1929 - I couldn't agree more.

If you don't want to be yelled at and "humiliated", go work at Baskin-Robbins. Anything worth having is worth suffering for. I don't bear any permanent scars (physical or emotional) from the ass-chewings I got at the Academy, or all the push-ups I had to do....in fact, I've been talked to and treated a lot worse by the motoring public in the years since then. As far as I'm concerned, anybody who quits because the academy environment is "too harsh" has shown their true colors - and I wouldn't want them rolling as my backup or sitting in the car as my partner. Rigid discipline, attention to detail and being pushed beyond your limits IS a learning process - and a valuable one at that. When the crap hits the fan, I'll take a grunt who knows what a "gut check" is over an educated pencil neck who's never learned what it means to push until you puke - because I already know which one will do me the most good when I need it.

Anybody who thinks the Academy environment is "too harsh" has absolutely no idea what the streets are like. The Academy instructors are yelling at you and pushing you for a reason - to make you tough mentally and physically, and able to handle this job. They don't hate you, and can't physically hurt you. The people on the streets who are getting in your face are doing it because they legitimately dislike and disrespect you, or at least what you stand for.....and they CAN and WILL physically hurt you....even kill you. When it gets down and dirty, there'll be nobody there to pat you on the butt and coo "come on, you can do it - just one more minute and you're done". If you can't hack the sterile, safe environment of the Academy, you have no business whatsoever pinning a badge on, calling yourself a cop and going out on the streets.....you don't have what it takes, plain and simple. You think the Academy is tough, you don't get enough sleep, and there's too much yelling? Wait until you work graveyard shift on day six of an eight-day stretch, wrestle with a couple pukey drunks and listen to them berate you all the way to jail; take a crash or two, dodge traffic, run around laying flares and deal with bloody mangled bodies, and maybe get in a pursuit - then spend all day in court, maybe get an hour or two of sleep (if the kids don't keep you awake or the wife doesn't need you for something or you don't have a 60-mile commute), and go back to work the next night and do it all over again. Now it's your turn to drive, and your "out" for the t/c and arrest....and your partner is just as tired as you because he was in court all day too. Oh, and speaking of court - you have to be back on the stand tomorrow morning at 0830 to finish up cross-examination with that aggravating defense attorney. Don't worry - maybe you can catch an hour of sleep in your car out in the back parking lot after shift and before court.....that is, if the freeway noise and the sun rising in your face don't keep you awake. Had enough yet? The Academy is downright PLUSH by comparison. Think I'm exaggerating? Show this to any cop from ANY agency who hasn't spent their whole career as a day shift drone or staff puke, and I guarantee you they'll read it, nod their head and tell you there'll be times like that.

I think the biggest mistake this Department could ever make would be to lower standards and/or ease the discipline at the Academy to increase recruitment. I'd rather roll to calls by myself all shift long than be surrounded by a bunch of second-rate non-hackers who don't deserve to be wearing the uniform in the first place. In the long term, any department will suffer from compromising their standards.....you attract more (qualified/motivated) applicants by being proud and elite than you do by being staffed with a bunch of no-loads who don't even qualify to be security guards at a shopping mall. It does a disservice to the public AND a disservice to the department. There's no pride in being given something you didn't earn.

Take a look at the military as a model. Anybody who volunteers to be a SEAL, Recon Marine, Ranger, etc. knows that they're (figuratively) walking straight into the jaws of hell when they start that training - they're going to be screamed at and pushed FAR beyond their mental/physical limitations - but from that molten crucible emerges a highly trained, motivated, squared-away person who understands that limitations are often in your own head, and realizes that they're capable of much more than they ever thought possible. They hold their heads high, and rightfully so.....they've earned that right, paid for in full by blood, sweat and tears. THAT'S what I'm talking about. You can have your take-home cars, warm and fuzzy no-stress academies that allow you to go grab a soy latte to decompress after class and sleep in your own beddy-bye at night, and all the other foo-foo crap. I'd rather drive used taxicabs and communicate with tin cans and string, and be surrounded by proud, tough teammates who EARNED the right to be called 'elite', and who I KNOW will 'sack up' when the time comes. I don't have any use for quitters and touchy-feelie sob sisters who crumble at the first sign of adversity or sacrifice.

I just know I'll puke my guts up the first time I see an officer break down in tears because a motorist yells at them over getting a seatbelt ticket, or their sergeant tells them that their activity sucked last month and they need to get their butt in gear. Never mind what will happen the first time a yoked-up parolee gets in their face and says there's no way in hell he's going back to prison.

[TheForceCHP]

CHP1929, RoadDawg, and Mac

i couldn't agree with all of what you said more! Every time you guys post stuff like this it just makes me look forward too the academy more. don't ask me why, but the thought of getting my butt kicked, getting in shape, and everything else is something that i will hate at the time, but will be able too look back on and be proud of who i will have become.

Thanks for another post that reminds me why i am choosing the CHP!!!

[Radar]

I don't know how many officers drop out during the break-in but I heard a lot.
There's a reason for that... They realize that the real world was far less sterile than the Academy... "What, you mean I can't call 'time-out' when this scenario goes bad?!... WHAT!! :shock: This isn't a SCENARIO?!?!?!?"

Why not let everyone graduate and then see how they perform at the field? Remember, we are trying to solve a problem of department understaffing and not who is tougher. I strongly believe that more lenient academy environment will lessen drop out rate because number of good cadets drop out because of the harsh environment.
Since the ends seem to justify the means in your line of thinking, why have an Academy at all... Think about it, it's a win/win. People could fill out an application, you know, like at McDonald's. Then, if they can spell their name correctly, we'll just bring 'em on in and see how they do on break-in. That way, they won't be subject to the cruel and unusual punishment of the horrible Academy... Not only that, but there'd be no need for instructors and Academy staff so they could all go back to the road, too... It'd be like a windfall of personnel flooding the field. Of course, we'd need more people for things like Color-Guard, Peer-Support, and IAS since those services would undoubtedly become higher in demand...

I think academy should not be a cut off point for someone who might become an outstanding CHP officer. What about a computer genius who wants to work in CHP computer forensics lab? He has to go through the academy just like anyone else but would he stick around for long in present training environment? I doubt it.
If he wants it bad enough, he would. If not, good, then he can T&D into another position... We refer to them with monikers such as WPT, OA, OT, AGPA, SSA, PSD I&II, CVIS, etc. Believe me, there are plenty of brilliant, squared-away, hard-working people who work for this Department in a non-uniformed capacity. Maybe they didn't want to be officers, maybe they couldn't hack it, maybe they couldn't do it for reasons beyond their control. I will throw the b/s flag (as, it seems, will many others on this post) if you really want to suggest that the alternative to our staffing issues is giving ANYBODY who raises their hand a badge and a gun, no questions asked.

Be careful, CACHP, in your assumption that this line of thinking will solve the Department's issues. Remember, most any solution to one problem will invariably present another. For every non-hacker you propose to roll out the red carpet for, you will likely have two or three people who DID make the commitment and follow through, who DID refuse to quit, who DID return to the Academy and reach the pinnacle of success after having been fired one, two, or three classes earlier. They will also leave this Department for an agency that refuses to sell out. You can feel free to extrapolate the numbers on that and see how we fare. While I think we, as a group, can come up with many awesome solutions to this issue, I, for one, am not willing to sell my soul and the soul of this Department to accomplish it.

These proposed solutions to the "inhumane and incomprehensible" ways of Academy life... Who are they REALLY designed to benefit? The CHP and those who currently serve with pride or those who couldn't hack it?

[Mac]

These proposed "solutions" to the inhumane and incomprehensible ways of Academy life... Who are they REALLY designed to benefit? The CHP and those who currently serve with pride or those who couldn't hack it?
The answer to that question is so obvious that it doesn't even bear repeating.

Why not let everyone graduate and then see how they perform at the field? Remember, we are trying to solve a problem of department understaffing and not who is tougher.
The day this Department takes that attitude will be the day I flush twenty-something years of service down the toilet and lateral to another agency that still has some pride and guts.

[retchp]

CHP 1929 said: "Someone said that the backgrounds screw up the whole process." and then disagreed.
I think that might have been a reference to my post in which I said there "ought to be some way to streamline the process" or some such sentence like that.
We really are not in disagreement there 1929. What I really meant to say, but tried to say in a more politically correct way than I should I guess was that the Department and it's BI corp need to be able to puke out a decision in an applicant in less than 6 months to a year.
You know as well as I do that it needn't take that long. How long does it take you to size some turd up on the side of the road? 6 months? I don't think so.
If an applicant is who he/she presents on paper and there is no negative feedback after a reasonable period of investigation, then send them onward and upward. If on the other hand, there is a bunch of negative crap coming out then send them packing. Just don't take half a year or more to do it and try to justify it by telling everyone "how busy you are".
When I reported in to N. Sacramento in 1985 all I heard all day everyday was how freakin "busy" everyone was. Frankly I wondered if I could hack it in such a place. It soon became apparent that they were all busy telling everyone who would listen how busy they all were instead of attending to the business at hand of making arrests and working crashes and then promptly and efficienetly writing the reports.
I suspect that is part of the problem in the BI process. You have a job to do just do it. And if you really are too "busy" then ask for help. And if help is asked for then the Department should give it.
Problem solved.

[pupdog]

I think long backgrounds contribute another problem...by the time they are done, have applicants moved on & found something else? One of my classmates was in the process a few years ago. She didn't hear a thing for the longest time. She finally signed up to join the army, and got her academy letter the day before she had to report to boot camp. Another applicant down the tubes.

[dw]

I've also got an ear over at backgrounds. Seems the top two DQ topics are 1. Drugs, 2. Credit (so, if you have good drugs and / or bad credit, ya'd better get squared away before applying). These are the main items that get a person DQ'ed. Guess its a different group than it was 24 years ago.

I also hear that so far, only about 500 applications for the next written have been received. To keep up with just retirements, the dept. needs to graduate over 200 folks per class. Kinda looks like we're on a sinking ship and no one knows what to do about it. Its a bit tough when local departments are offering stuff like "top step within 2 years...sign-on bonus...4/10 shifts.." etc. We offer free room / board / gettin' yelled at for 26 (?) weeks and then get to go to one of the most expensive places in the US to try to live on $50K / year.

Not griping. Just throwing the stuff on the table.

Must be different where you are, because in my experience, the #1 reason for disqualifications, far and away, us dishonesty. Also, the number of 500 applications for the next test because the number most likely refers to only one Division, not Statewide.

[dw]

There used to be a CHP academy somewhere in LA area but it was closed. To reopen it, in order to graduate more cadets, will cost the department big money, but to graduate cadets who might drop out, because they don?t want to be humiliated, would save money. Hypothetically speaking: Let?s say about 25 cadets drop out from every class. 25 cadets times 4 classes a year is 100 cadets. About 100 cadets drop out from the academy in one year. That is like a whole class. Approximately $60K is spent during the hiring process per cadet so $60K *100 = $6,000,000 a year. If the academy loses 100 cadets every year, $6,000,000 is lost every year. I am sure these moneys can be used for other things. And with such a loss a year it comes out to only three classes a year instead of four.

You mean the Clark Training Center? It was never a full Academy, and to my knowledge, it still exists. If you drop out of the Academy because you don't want to be humiliated, you're going to have big problems were you ever to see the road. And I'm not sure where you got your numbers, but the last survey I've seen was from the 90s and the numbers were a bit more then you quoted.


I think academy should not be a cut off point for someone who might become an outstanding CHP officer. What about a computer genius who wants to work in CHP computer forensics lab? He has to go through the academy just like anyone else but would he stick around for long in present training environment? I doubt it.

When did we get a forensics lab? If we did, the position you describe would likely be non-uniformed.


Also, if a said there should be an easy way for dropped out cadets to come back to the academy, I apologize; I meant there should be a simple way. I, myself, haven?t thought about going back, but I do know couple of people who dropped out and want to go back. One dropped out because of harsh environm ent and the other because of PT. I think giving dropped out cadets a second chance will minimize the departmental hiring spendingbecause they don?t have to be put through extensive background check. Once again, this post, as I understood it, was about suggesting how to save money and hire/ keep more people. Sorry, if I misled someone. I am not trying to change your point of view. I am just presenting mine. Thank you for listening.
There is a pretty easy way to come back -- reapply. Yes, you're going to have to explain why you deserve a second chance to the QAP, but it happens.

[dw]

CHP1929, that's one hell of a first post! It is hard to argue with good sense and the truth, but someone here will try.

Agree with you 100% CHP1929, well said.

[dw]

Obviously, I've been off the site for a couple days. Let me say this in regard to the class dates getting pushed back. "What I heard" through the grapevine was at the end of this month, the Commissioners would decide if the May 29th class should be pushed back either 30 or 60 days so it would be full with 180 Cadets.

[uoplax13]

I hope the next class gets pushed back, and I hope it stays just as tough as it sounds. A few people have touched on it already, and I have to agree that kids my age (early twenties) are not what they were 20, 10, or even 5 years ago. It's not necessarily a bad thing, but it seems that in law enforcement it pays to not be coddled through life. The few officers I know, and others I've met through ride alongs have all been nice people, but I'd bet my life on them not breaking down and crying when some jerk gives them a little crap on the side of the road, or worse. A big part of that is how they were brought up, and the fact that it wasn't some new thing for them...i.e. they took it at the academy. I'm probably what you call a sissified college boy, who grew up in a very liberal home, but I candle handle pressure. I'm sure I'll learn to handle even more at the academy.

Officers, please don't take offense, but here's an example from my own life of what happens when things are watered down because they're too tough: When I joined my fraternity back in college (on top of being a sissified, liberal college boy, I was in a frat too) we had the crap "hazed" out of us. No farm animals or human sacrifice, but plenty of yelling, calistenics, runnings, etc.... Since I went through it about 6 or 7 years ago it has become slightly watered down each and every year. Not only do you start losing some tradition, but the quality of the guys suffers. I was back down that way to visit some friends just this weekend and stopped by my old house.....it was trashed and the "youngin's" were disrespectful in front of alumni, elderly people, and female guests....the kind of stuff that wouldn't have flown "back in the day". It just kind of showed what happened when you go and take it down a couple notches because recruitment was suffering because of a lack good people.

I would trust most of the guys to have my back if the situation arose, but I don't think the new breed of guys have the balls (for lack of better wording). Long story short, I'd hate to see a similar situation with the CHP. The last thing you probably want is a partner that would second guess tackling some tweeker that was about to hurt you out on a stop.

[Kevin]

If one cannot hack it in a California POST law enforcement academy, they should have no business being a cop. I wouldn't want to work with some pansy ass reject. If you cannot take the heat, you need to get out of the kitchen. If it's one thing I hate, it is whining people with no backbone! Pack up your bag and hit the road, don't let the door hit you on the way out!

As for solutions, maybe it's time the CHP start hiring laterals such as myself! Seven year veteran here, shouldn't have to start as a "cadet" all over again. Dammit, I earned it!!! ;)

[Officer_Grady]

Kevin, why would you leave where you work and sign up with us? Just curious.

[dw]

I'm probably what you call a sissified college boy, who grew up in a very liberal home, but I candle handle pressure. I'm sure I'll learn to handle even more at the academy.


As am I... And I made it through all the yelling, pushups, and never once got my precious little feelings hurt. If I can do it, anyone can. I had no background in the military, law enforcement, or fitness. I think the Academy was a great personal experience because I really did learn what I can do when pushed beyond the every-day comfort level. I wouldn't want to go back, but I'm very glad I've had the experience.

[Officer_Grady]

dw, there is a computer crimes unit and the two officers and Lt came into in service to talk, what a waste of time because they sounded like they were more BIA, no mis use of email, that kind of stuff. Not after the arrest, finding computers and writing search warrants to bust into the puters for more evidence type of officers. They actually looked geeky, I wonder how they ever made it off of breakin, but as a co-worker or mine says, "The cancer is already in."

[CACHP]

This thread is blowing me away? (Not literally :biggrin: ) Most of you posting in this thread have not even been through our Academy, so what do you have to base your opinion on? CACHP post like he/she is an officer, but its not confirmed through the website, and from his / her views, I doubt it?

I am not a CHP officer.

[Officer_Grady]

kid, the crooks are still going to be crooks, even if times are changing. If they see any hesitation on your part, you're dead, do you understand that? Voice don't mean squat. You gotta back it up cause when the doo doo hits the fan, someone needs to take care of it. I don't want your name on the fountain, my classmate and FTO are on there now. In terms of people helping you to get through the academy, it starts from within. Look at the mirror, you say they will not make me quit. You quit yourself. If anything, the food there should have made you quit. Face it, you were not meant to be a highway man right now. Maybe three years from now, you will have another view, maybe you wouldn't even think of the HP. Oh, you mention the staff sgt said you were one of the best, what the heck do you expect him/ her to say, they are just CYA so they don't get a complaint. This thread should end as it's beating a dead horse.

[Kevin]

Kevin, why would you leave where you work and sign up with us? Just curious.

1. 3%@50 PERS
2. Work/transfer, anywhere in the state
3. Lots of freedom and time for proactive work and not have to chase the radio all day long
4. Less oversight, fever headaches
5. Lots of promotional opportunities

I believe working for the CHP for the most part is how you make of it, you can fight crime and write tickets all you want or you can do it at a slower pace if you choose to do so. Correct me if I'm wrong, but in slower areas such as the Central Valley and desert areas, I would think that you are afforded a great deal of discretion and are expected to be capable and competent of handling your business without much supervision. None of this what's your 10-20 and are you 10-8 kind of crap...

[Officer_Grady]

Kevin, evrything except #4. It looks greener on the other side, but the problems in your dept are probably in ours. Central Valley and desert, I can not answer for as I've worked big cities with freeways and airships flying around. I would not under estimate Central Valley nor desert as that's where the real highwaymen work. The valley has alot of drug activity and 11550 and desert backup may be over an hour away. The 10-20 and 10-8 crap, just depends on the sgt, if they are sticklers, that's how they are, if you are good and get your numbers and answer your radio, no problem. I like to go and never tell anyone till I get there, just more sneaky.

[dw]

dw, there is a computer crimes unit and the two officers and Lt came into in service to talk, what a waste of time because they sounded like they were more BIA, no mis use of email, that kind of stuff. Not after the arrest, finding computers and writing search warrants to bust into the puters for more evidence type of officers. They actually looked geeky, I wonder how they ever made it off of breakin, but as a co-worker or mine says, "The cancer is already in."

I am aware of the CCIU, but I don't think we're losing people because of three positions out of 7,000. I think it is inappropriate to badmouth them because whether anyone wants to admit it, they do serve a purpose. And clearly, they did make it through the Academy and through break-in. I suppose I look geeky from time to time, but that has nothing to do with the way I do my job.

[RodeoChippie]

So I guess the question is, when you utilized your strong hand to remove your cover and place it behind your back, were you carrying your cover in your strong hand from the point it came off your pointy little grape to the point it was placed behind your back or did it just miracle itself back there? Bottom line is that this was a learning experience. You are still whining about it to this day so obviously the staff officer made their point because you have yet to forget that you are not to put anything in your strong hand.

In reality we probably should be very grateful that you quit. I'm sure your position was filled by someone who wanted to be there and was ready to "cowboy up"! (notice the theme? Rodeochippie/cowboy up)

[Kevin]

I suppose I look geeky from time to time, but that has nothing to do with the way I do my job.

Is this you dw? j/k!
http://www.chez.com/matapia/5116.jpg:lol:

[dw]

The thing is, if you can not adapt to a change, you will not survive.

I think you intended this to mean the Academy needs change, but the exact same thing can be said of the Cadet. If you can not adapt to Law Enforcement, you will not survive.


Why do I need to hand write a report when I can use a computer and type it? Instead of making me write through the ruler, teach me the proper way to type so I can type up a report lots faster. Why take away my study time by making me do pointless things?

Because many of the forms you complete must to be handwritten on a daily basis (logs, DMV forms, citations, vehicle storage reports) and they must be spelled correctly and legible -- many of them are legal documents.


How many CHP officers are actually shining their boots every night?

I do. I've noticed more senior officers tend to value appearance more than junior ones...


I considered that incident as humiliation and a staff officers search for reasons to yell at cadets.

Who cares if they yell at you? Really? I got yelled at plenty and never felt humiliated in the least. In fact, rarely was I listening to more than I needed to for basic responses.

[dw]

I suppose I look geeky from time to time, but that has nothing to do with the way I do my job.

Is this you dw? j/k!
http://www.chez.com/matapia/5116.jpg:lol:

Your link's not working, so I guess that shows how much of geek you are, Kevin! ;) :cool:

[CACHP]

This thread should end as it's beating a dead horse.

I agree!

[dw]

I suppose I look geeky from time to time, but that has nothing to do with the way I do my job.

Is this you dw? j/k!
http://www.chez.com/matapia/5116.jpg:lol:

No, I'm waaayyyyy too cool to wear a helmet! :cool:

[Kevin]

One thing I don't like about the CHP is the funny looking bright blue bow tie... :rolleyes:

It would also be great if they switch to dark navy blue uniform (traditional police uniform) for their class A & B instead of the tan.
:smile:

[dw]

One thing I don't like about the CHP is the funny looking blue bow tie... :rolleyes:


No one said you had to be a motor! They look funny enough as it is. ;)


It would also be great if they switch to dark navy blue uniform (traditional police uniform) for their class A & B instead of the tan.
:smile:
I gotta' say, as impractical as the tans are, I like them. I dunno, I guess I just watched too much CHiPs as a kid.

Are you taking our test already??? Just go through the process, you can always waive. :smile:

[CACHP]

[Officer_Grady]

Kev, I know the uniform looks funny with that royal blue tie and all, and more officers are wearing the BDUs, at least we don't have to haul our Class A green jacket to demos anymore. One thing about the uniform, 209 officers died in that dress, I use to not like our uniform, but since the recent deaths, I respect it more and for all the officers, retired and past, who paved the way for what we have today, thanks.

[Kevin]

In reality we probably should be very grateful that you quit.


To clarify; I did not quit, I resigned. And trust me, some superiors, at the academy, were not grateful about it.

Quit = Resign

Sorry to say, the academy staff weren't grateful is because they wasted their valuable time on a quitter. It's always easier to quit than to suck it up!

[HwyChaser]

Who cares if they yell at you? Really? I got yelled at plenty and never felt humiliated in the least. In fact, rarely was I listening to more than I needed to for basic responses.

Infact, the yelling would make my day. My roomates and I would crack up all night long repeating what the staff officers said. It?s been almost 5 years and we still call eachother and laugh about it. I have the same frame of mind while working the road. Someone might call me every name in the book while screaming at the top of thier lungs. I remain profesional while on scene with them, but once I get back to the office the stories and laughs start flying.:lol: This seems a little off topic, but my point is that the yelling serves a purpose. CACHP obviously could not handle the yelling and quit. I'm not trying to show any disrespect to him, but he obviously would not have been happy as an officer working the road and getting yelled at and a daily basis.

[Kevin]

Who cares if they yell at you? Really? I got yelled at plenty and never felt humiliated in the least. In fact, rarely was I listening to more than I needed to for basic responses.

Infact, the yelling would make my day. My roomates and I would crack up all night long repeating what the staff officers said. It?s been almost 5 years and we still call eachother and laugh about it. I have the same frame of mind while working the road. Someone might call me every name in the book while screaming at the top of thier lungs. I remain profesional while on scene with them, but once I get back to the office the stories and laughs start flying.:lol: This seems a little off topic, but my point is that the yelling serves a purpose. CACHP obviously could not handle the yelling and quit. I'm not trying to show any disrespect to him, but he obviously would not have been happy as an officer working the road and getting yelled at and a daily basis.

The day I graduated on stage and received my star made all that yelling, PT, LD's and other academy BS seemed like nothing. It was a very proud moment to have made it that far. Now when I think back, it wasn't that bad... :cool:

[CACHP]

[Kevin]

They were pleading for me to stay.

For some unknown reasons, I smell BS... :badgrin:

[dw]

Now when I think back, it wasn't that bad... :cool:

See, you can do it one more time before you die... (No, I'm not giving up on recruiting you.) ;) This is a recruitment thread, after all.

[CACHP]

[Chippysgt]

Back when I went through the Academy, barely 100 years after the end of the Civil War, we were out on Meadowview Road. The duty office was not a place for newbies climbing the ladder. They were seasoned older officers who you could look up to. The instructors and staff were just as hard on us but you never felt like they were berating you. They just expected a lot and you just knew they had been there and done that. I think the duty office should be a place for the old timers who have a calling to help the new people and want to get off the road for a while. I think the drill instructor stuff should come from the instructors, especially the PT staff. One thing that I remember is that the academy staff earned our respect and that is what made the difference. You don't mind getting hosed if you screw up but it has to come from someone you respect or it generates contempt.

[Officer_Grady]

Chipsgt, question regarding respect. Do you earn it or you expect respect because of the position? Werid thing was I was talking to a retired sgt and he said it's good to get feedback from the shift and squad on presentation as the message sometimes goes sideways. Funny, I don't think my sgts think like that and what they say they think is gospel. I just go up the next level and ask, not suppose to, but I do it when needed. Grady

[Kevin]

Back when I went through the Academy, barely 100 years after the end of the Civil War I didn't know they had academies back in the 1960's....I was always told that they were issued a gun & badge and told to take care off business :lol:

[RodeoChippie]

http://kevinremde.members.winisp.net/images/beating_2Da_2Ddead_2Dhorse.gif

[Kevin]

http://kevinremde.members.winisp.net/images/beating_2Da_2Ddead_2Dhorse.gif

Looks like you guys beated that animal to death.....597 PC - Cruelty to animals ;)

[THEDARKKNIGHT]

man, took me all day to read this thread! kept having to leave to do other things. but nothing here has changd my mind and i am scheduled for my written test on may 20th and i plan to see the whole thing through.

[23109]

Heh, CACHP was a classmate.

[cacop]

As a current PD officer I too believe the CHP should offer a lateral program. I have no problem (looking forward to it actually) doing the academy and believe we should still pay our dues, but a very accelerated hiring program should be implemented.

Maybe us laterals could be put at the top of list and immediately put through all testing in a couple of days then have our own couple of bi's to knock out our cases. A lateral program completed in less then 60 days...I believe it's possible.

To the kid who quit....Thank you, just from reading your post's you are no person this officer would want watching my or my buddies six's ever!!! You have obviously rationalized and justified in your own mind why you QUIT, now go back to the playstation 2, mom's cooking and your comforting girlfriend who is embarrassed when people ask her why her stud quit the CHP academy.

[CACHP]

I have removed my latest replies because they seem to offend some readers. My apologies, everyone.

[not5150]

CACHP... If your initial posts didn't give an idea of your character, your last post certainly did.

You keep digging an ever-increasing hole for yourself.

[makakona]

Most of you posting in this thread have not even been through our Academy, so what do you have to base your opinion on?
you're right. i sometimes forget my "place" around these here parts. my family is a mix of so/pd/fd and i married into a chp family. my opinions are based on what i gather from my family's immediate experience with the chp and ultimately, i care most about officer safety and whether or not something will make it less likely for my husband to make it home after his shift.

at this point, i'm honestly shocked that cachp even made it through backgrounds with such a crappy attitude and bizarre viewpoints. i guess it's like i tell my unmarried sisters-in-law about the guys they bring home... anyone can make themselves look good for a year or so, come talk to me next year. exactly how long did you last at the academy, cachp, before you quit?

as for being an unexperienced spouse, i'll try to keep my opinions where they belong and hold water. i'm just totally blown away and disgusted by some of the stuff i've seen here, but i understand that almost all of you are more qualified to comment than am i.

[dw]

...and we're done. thread locked.