Hey bcjack

[SB 405]

Check out what LA City Fire is testing for it's BC's to drive..

http://www.emergencyrigs.net/viewphoto.asp?PhotoID=2747&Size=med_

http://www.emergencyrigs.net/viewphoto.asp?PhotoID=2744&Size=med_

http://www.emergencyrigs.net/viewphoto.asp?PhotoID=2745&Size=med_

Looks like a Catering truck to me:lol:

[SB 405]

Check out the way the boys "down under" arrive on scene.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAMf2uesu0A

[redhead]

Check out the way the boys "down under" arrive on scene.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAMf2uesu0ADAMN!

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/5731/ffdunr2.jpg

[bcjack]

sb405:

I will drive whatever the City provides me...Keep it full of gas (or diesel), maintain it...I will be perfectly happy:biggrin:

The catering truck looks interesting though.

[bcjack]

The arrival of the Queensland truck is no big deal...that is how I arrive at work every day...(07:59:58 hrs):badgrin:

[Welpe]

The arrival of the Queensland truck is no big deal...that is how I arrive at work every day...(07:59:58 hrs):badgrin:

So you're the guy we're always hearing about on the news up here. :lol:

[bcjack]

welpe:

Yes...I think...Part of my job is feeding the hungry beast (the news media) news stories.:biggrin:

[chico.medic]

I like that setup on the BC truck. Nice little mobile command station. Radio, computer, pullout map table.

[Welpe]

welpe:

Yes...I think...Part of my job is feeding the hungry beast (the news media) news stories.:biggrin:

Do you guys get the New Times down there? If not, I'll forward along any articles I find about you in there.

"Renegade Fire BC Nearly Takes out Bus Full of Nuns"

"Fire Department BC Not Interested in Public Safety"

What a great "news paper". :rolleyes:

[bcjack]

The New Times and Sun are owned by the same group. I feed the Sun a copy of every news brief, so I ASSUME the new times has access to them too. My stories are not "controversial" enough for New Times...AND I am an upstanding kind of guy so there is no "dirt" they can drum up....:badgrin:

Joe "Just the facts maam" Friday was my role model for news story writing...BUT...if I had my druthers, my writing style would be more like Rush Limbaugh... :badgrin:

[SB 405]

Alright bc time to pick your brain again. Please read and give me your thoughts


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LA HABRA HEIGHTS - A man who used his own fire engine to extinguish a car fire has been warned not to butt into official city firefighting operations.

City Attorney Sandra Levin has issued a "cease and desist" letter demanding George Edwardz not to do any more firefighting after he helped put out a car fire across the street from his house.

"We have been informed of your participation in the response to a recent car fire within the boundaries of La Habra Heights," Levin stated in the letter.

"Accordingly we write to remind you of the prohibition on unauthorized firefighting activities within the city and to demand that you cease and desist from conducting any firefighting, rescue and/or paramedic operations within the city limits of La Habra Heights," the letter stated.

Levin also threatened Edwardz that any attempt to fight fires would be in violation of the city's municipal code and is a misdemeanor.

Edwardz said he was shocked by the letter, saying that he did nothing wrong by helping out in the Oct. 12 incident on Harbor Boulevard.

"I'm a criminal because I put out a fire," he said. "That's great. I'd gladly do it again."

Edwardz said the incident began at about 9a.m. when he saw the fire through a window of his home and decided to investigate in his 1980 Pierce mini-pumper fire engine.

A La Habra police officer was at the scene, and Edwardz asked him if he needed help.

"I told him I'm not a firefighter and he said, `That's OK. The Fire Department is on its way. Put some water on it."'

Los Angeles County firefighters showed up and used water from Edwardz' engine, finishing the job, he said. La Habra Heights firefighters arrived later.

Levin said Thursday she couldn't comment on the Oct. 12 incident, saying the letter wasn't necessarily aimed at what happened then.

"This letter isn't really intended as a criticism of something that has happened so far," she said. "It's a precautionary measure so that, in the event of a significant emergency, the responsible agencies have unimpeded access."

Edwardz said he bought the engine for $7,200 in March with the idea of donating it to the city in order to provide more service for the east side of La Habra Heights.

He has proposed that a small station be put on his property on Fullerton Road.

When the city rejected the donation and the proposal for another station, Edwardz said he decided to form a volunteer fire department for the east side of La Habra Heights.

It consists of Edwardz and two professional firefighters, who don't want to release their names, according to Edwardz.

Edwardz said he became concerned when it took emergency responders 12 minutes to get to his house after he had an accident several years ago.

City Manager Ron Bates said the city rejected the donation because it has all the equipment it needs.

Bates said the city already is well served thanks to a mutual aid program with Los Angeles County, which now serves La Habra.

"The response times for residents from a combination of our station, the La Habra station and the Hacienda Heights station is wonderful," he said.

Bates said the average response time is about five minutes.


His web site and pictures of his rig.

http://www.edwardz.com/

[bcjack]

Soooo many thoughts, so little time...Legally, I would say he is way out-of-bounds. There are so many laws and standards to comply with to become a firefighter, let alone start or operate a fire department. And of course, don't foget the liability the City is opening itself to if they don't issue the "Cease & Desist" order. As much as this guy probably wants to "Help", and has the best of intentions, if it was occurring here, I would follow the same course. The potential for negative effects to the individual, his neighbors and the responding emegency workers is so high, I just can't see any alternative for the City.

If he wants a station near his home, go through the political process and work on getting it done right. We are trained professionals and know our business very well. Our community leaders (Council, Board of Sup.) make decisions to allocate resources and funding based on the recommendations of the professionals and the available funding. The need for a fire station is something that is looked at "Seven ways from Sunday". I was involved in the re-location of one station and the construction of a new station here and the study took two years, and the total time from concept to opening the new station was about five years. A new fire station has a price tag of $500,000 to $750,000 for the land (dirt), $1.6 million for the building, and... $1.1 million per year to keep it open. That ain't cheap!!!!!! There are alternatives to opening a new station if the concern is call volume. If the concern is response time, there are fewer alternatives to cover that issue, but there are some.

I don't think he would be welcome if he was riding around in a black & white (retired) police car stopping cars because "They were driving too fast" in his neighborhood.

[bcjack]

CA Penal Code...

538e. (a) Any person, other than an officer or member of a fire
department, who willfully wears, exhibits, or uses the authorized
uniform, insignia, emblem, device, label, certificate, card, or
writing of an officer or member of a fire department or a deputy
state fire marshal, with the intent of fraudulently personating an
officer or member of a fire department or the Office of the State
Fire Marshal, or of fraudulently inducing the belief that he or she
is an officer or member of a fire department or the Office of the
State Fire Marshal, is guilty of a misdemeanor.
(b) (1) Any person, other than the one who by law is given the
authority of an officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy
state fire marshal, who willfully wears, exhibits, or uses the badge
of a fire department or the Office of the State Fire Marshal with the
intent of fraudulently impersonating an officer, or member of a fire
department, or a deputy state fire marshal, or of fraudulently
inducing the belief that he or she is an officer or member of a fire
department, or a deputy state fire marshal, is guilty of a
misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not to exceed
one year, by a fine not to exceed two thousand dollars ($2,000), or
by both that imprisonment and fine.
(2) Any person who willfully wears or uses any badge that falsely
purports to be authorized for the use of one who by law is given the
authority of an officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy
state fire marshal, or which so resembles the authorized badge of an
officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy state fire
marshal as would deceive any ordinary reasonable person into
believing that it is authorized for the use of one who by law is
given the authority of an officer or member of a fire department or a
deputy state fire marshal, for the purpose of fraudulently
impersonating an officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy
state fire marshal, or of fraudulently inducing the belief that he or
she is an officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy state
fire marshal, is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment
in a county jail not to exceed one year, by a fine not to exceed two
thousand dollars ($2,000), or by both that imprisonment and fine.
(c) Any person who willfully wears, exhibits, or uses, or who
willfully makes, sells, loans, gives, or transfers to another, any
badge, insignia, emblem, device, or any label, certificate, card, or
writing, which falsely purports to be authorized for the use of one
who by law is given the authority of an officer, or member of a fire
department or a deputy state fire marshal, or which so resembles the
authorized badge, insignia, emblem, device, label, certificate, card,
or writing of an officer or member of a fire department or a deputy
state fire marshal as would deceive an ordinary reasonable person
into believing that it is authorized for use by an officer or member
of a fire department or a deputy state fire marshal, is guilty of a
misdemeanor, except that any person who makes or sells any badge
under the circumstances described in this subdivision is guilty of a
misdemeanor punishable by a fine not to exceed fifteen thousand
dollars ($15,000).
(d) Any person who, for the purpose of selling, leasing or
otherwise disposing of merchandise, supplies or equipment used in
fire prevention or suppression, falsely represents, in any manner
whatsoever, to any other person that he or she is a fire marshal,
fire inspector or member of a fire department, or that he or she has
the approval, endorsement or authorization of any fire marshal, fire
inspector or fire department, or member thereof, is guilty of a
misdemeanor.
(e) This section shall not apply to either of the following:
(1) Use of a badge solely as a prop for a motion picture,
television, or video production, or an entertainment or theatrical
event.
(2) A badge supplied by a recognized employee organization as
defined in Section 3501 of the Government Code representing
firefighters or a state or international organization to which it is
affiliated.

CA Vehicle Code:

27905. It is unlawful to display on a vehicle any sign with the
words "fire" or "fire department" thereon, except on vehicles owned
and operated by a regularly organized fire department, fire district,
forestry service, or the State Fire Marshal's Office, and on the
privately owned vehicles of any regular member of any such fire
departments.

[Mac]

Wow.....the guy may have the best of intentions, but I can see why the city had to do what they did (even as nonsensical as it seems at first glance). The liability issue alone is more than enough of a problem if they give "tacit approval" to his activities.

I don't think he would be welcome if he was riding around in a black & white (retired) police car stopping cars because "They were driving too fast" in his neighborhood.
Yeah, but we all know that everybody hates cops and loves firefighters! :lol:

[bcjack]

mac:

I meant the City would not welcome the guy pretending to be a cop either...

[Mac]

I meant the City would not welcome the guy pretending to be a cop either...
lol....I know, I was just pokin' a little fun. ;) I definitely don't think the city would appreciate that either!

[G-Man]

CA Penal Code...

538e. (a) Any person, other than an officer or member of a fire
department, who willfully wears, exhibits, or uses the authorized
uniform, insignia, emblem, device, label, certificate, card, or
writing of an officer or member of a fire department or a deputy
state fire marshal, with the intent of fraudulently personating an
officer or member of a fire department or the Office of the State
Fire Marshal, or of fraudulently inducing the belief that he or she
is an officer or member of a fire department or the Office of the
State Fire Marshal, is guilty of a misdemeanor.
(b) (1) Any person, other than the one who by law is given the
authority of an officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy
state fire marshal, who willfully wears, exhibits, or uses the badge
of a fire department or the Office of the State Fire Marshal with the
intent of fraudulently impersonating an officer, or member of a fire
department, or a deputy state fire marshal, or of fraudulently
inducing the belief that he or she is an officer or member of a fire
department, or a deputy state fire marshal, is guilty of a
misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not to exceed
one year, by a fine not to exceed two thousand dollars ($2,000), or
by both that imprisonment and fine.
(2) Any person who willfully wears or uses any badge that falsely
purports to be authorized for the use of one who by law is given the
authority of an officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy
state fire marshal, or which so resembles the authorized badge of an
officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy state fire
marshal as would deceive any ordinary reasonable person into
believing that it is authorized for the use of one who by law is
given the authority of an officer or member of a fire department or a
deputy state fire marshal, for the purpose of fraudulently
impersonating an officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy
state fire marshal, or of fraudulently inducing the belief that he or
she is an officer or member of a fire department, or a deputy state
fire marshal, is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment
in a county jail not to exceed one year, by a fine not to exceed two
thousand dollars ($2,000), or by both that imprisonment and fine.
(c) Any person who willfully wears, exhibits, or uses, or who
willfully makes, sells, loans, gives, or transfers to another, any
badge, insignia, emblem, device, or any label, certificate, card, or
writing, which falsely purports to be authorized for the use of one
who by law is given the authority of an officer, or member of a fire
department or a deputy state fire marshal, or which so resembles the
authorized badge, insignia, emblem, device, label, certificate, card,
or writing of an officer or member of a fire department or a deputy
state fire marshal as would deceive an ordinary reasonable person
into believing that it is authorized for use by an officer or member
of a fire department or a deputy state fire marshal, is guilty of a
misdemeanor, except that any person who makes or sells any badge
under the circumstances described in this subdivision is guilty of a
misdemeanor punishable by a fine not to exceed fifteen thousand
dollars ($15,000).
(d) Any person who, for the purpose of selling, leasing or
otherwise disposing of merchandise, supplies or equipment used in
fire prevention or suppression, falsely represents, in any manner
whatsoever, to any other person that he or she is a fire marshal,
fire inspector or member of a fire department, or that he or she has
the approval, endorsement or authorization of any fire marshal, fire
inspector or fire department, or member thereof, is guilty of a
misdemeanor.
(e) This section shall not apply to either of the following:
(1) Use of a badge solely as a prop for a motion picture,
television, or video production, or an entertainment or theatrical
event.
(2) A badge supplied by a recognized employee organization as
defined in Section 3501 of the Government Code representing
firefighters or a state or international organization to which it is
affiliated.

CA Vehicle Code:

27905. It is unlawful to display on a vehicle any sign with the
words "fire" or "fire department" thereon, except on vehicles owned
and operated by a regularly organized fire department, fire district,
forestry service, or the State Fire Marshal's Office, and on the
privately owned vehicles of any regular member of any such fire
departments.


Just remember though, said he told the Officer he was not a fire fighter... It is not illegal to own a runout firetruck, just like it is not against the law to own a runout cop car (as long as the car is repainted). According to these sections if he drove up in the truck wearing a pair of shorts and an AC/DC t-shirt and the truck did not say "Fire" or Fire Department" on the side he is not guilty of anything in these particular sections. Municipal Codes would be a different story.

I think the truck said VFD on the side, so the VC section would stick (I hope). He is not selling, leasing or otherwise disposing of the truck... so I don't think the (d) section would stick. And he did not intend to impersonate a firefighter (told the Officer he was not a firefighter).

I am not condoning what he did, leave the job to the professionals. I can't stand being told how to do my job by the people I pull over. I think that would be a liability for the officer, having an unknown person messing around at his or her scene.

Just one persons interpretation and if I am wrong, it won't be a first time.:biggrin:

[bcjack]

G-man:

Without being there, I made some assumptions and brought some potential concerns out. Any way you look at it, what he did was not a good idea and could open the City up to a ton of liability if they didn't go on the record by telling him to cease and desist.

[G-Man]

I said I did not approve of his activities.

[bcjack]

10-4 G-man...

[SB 405]

Came across this story bc and thought I'd pass it on for you to read. I think it showed a lot of class form the LA County FD.

http://cms.firehouse.com/content/article/article.jsp?sectionId=46&id=53608

[SB 405]

Hey bc I found this great old video showing how LA City Fire got the job done back in the 40's.


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3142881124403379801&q=your+fire+department

[bcjack]

Came across this story bc and thought I'd pass it on for you to read. I think it showed a lot of class form the LA County FD.

http://cms.firehouse.com/content/article/article.jsp?sectionId=46&id=53608

That was a really cool story. We are truly a close family.

[bcjack]

Hey bc I found this great old video showing how LA City Fire got the job done back in the 40's.


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3142881124403379801&q=your+fire+department

Cool video...