No Crosses For Dead Cops In Utah

[AyatollahGondola]

American Atheists, Inc. v. Duncan, 2010 U.S. App. LEXIS 17249, August 18, 2010
The Utah Highway Patrol Association, with the permission of Utah state authorities, erected a number of twelve-foot high crosses on public land to memorialize fallen Utah Highway Patrol troopers.
The court held that these memorials have the impermissible effect of conveying to the reasonable observer the message that the State prefers or otherwise endorses a certain religion, and therefore, they violate the Establishment Clause of the United States Constitution.

http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-10th-circuit/1535381.html?DCMP=NWL-pro_conlaw

[bookin]

Ridiculous :hitwall:

[CTC III-05]

So, they find a different shape for the memorial. Doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

Crosses, a tie to some religions, definitely fall under the establishment clause and whether us in the law enforcement community like it or not, we are bound by the same restrictions as everyone else when it comes to the Constitution.

[Mac]

Ridiculous :hitwall:
+1,000,000.

But not surprising at all, given the direction our nation is heading.

[iwannabeachp]

Agreed....Just plain silly:doh:

[AyatollahGondola]

So, they find a different shape for the memorial. Doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

Crosses, a tie to some religions, definitely fall under the establishment clause and whether us in the law enforcement community like it or not, we are bound by the same restrictions as everyone else when it comes to the Constitution.

I did not read the case summary, but I don't see how displaying a cross establishes a religion. Seems to me that there's now a prohibition, and that infringes upon the free exercise of religion. This kind of follows the banning of Christmas and nativity scenes and such. Wonder if the same conclusion would have been reached had there been another symbol in the mix.

[bcjack]

I call Bu*****t!!!!!! The memorial should be designed any way the creators want to design it. I see no "forced religion" in the display of a symbol that is intended to remember those fallen officers.

[AyatollahGondola]

impermissible effect of conveying to the reasonable observer the message that the State prefers or otherwise endorses

This may be the key. Is the court saying that those who believe in christianity are unresonable?

[CAHPDist2X]

I've had a lot of conversations with our Utah brothern on this subject and I think they have a solution. The argument is that by using a Christian cross,and erecting it with state resources on state land, the state appears to endores that religious concept over all others. That is kind of an obvious thing in Utah anyway but the solution they came up with was a wealthy supporter bought small sections of land adjacent to the state right of way and placed the crosses there. As an extra tit for tat, he lined up several of the crosses along the commute route of the athiest who made the lawsuit so he would see tham each day as he went to work.

[Ozzy]

I've had a lot of conversations with our Utah brothern on this subject and I think they have a solution. The argument is that by using a Christian cross,and erecting it with state resources on state land, the state appears to endores that religious concept over all others. That is kind of an obvious thing in Utah anyway but the solution they came up with was a wealthy supporter bought small sections of land adjacent to the state right of way and placed the crosses there. As an extra tit for tat, he lined up several of the crosses along the commute route of the athiest who made the lawsuit so he would see tham each day as he went to work.

Now that's awsome.

[iwannabeachp]

I've had a lot of conversations with our Utah brothern on this subject and I think they have a solution. The argument is that by using a Christian cross,and erecting it with state resources on state land, the state appears to endores that religious concept over all others. That is kind of an obvious thing in Utah anyway but the solution they came up with was a wealthy supporter bought small sections of land adjacent to the state right of way and placed the crosses there. As an extra tit for tat, he lined up several of the crosses along the commute route of the athiest who made the lawsuit so he would see tham each day as he went to work.


That man just became my new hero :lol::lol::lol:

[Mac]

...but the solution they came up with was a wealthy supporter bought small sections of land adjacent to the state right of way and placed the crosses there. As an extra tit for tat, he lined up several of the crosses along the commute route of the athiest who made the lawsuit so he would see tham each day as he went to work.
MAJOR kudos to that man! I like his style - we need more people like that in the world. I hope the plaintiff enjoys the view during his daily commute...what a wonderful demonstration of the old maxim, "Win the battle, lose the war". :badgrin: